DIVORCE - such an ugly word!

[saved]

Hello Everyone!

I was reading a posting in another section and this question came to mind?

For those who feel they are not in the will of God or that their marriage isn't ordained by God is it ok for them to get a divorce? .......... and God not hold that against them?

I would say NO! But I was wondering what you thought.

I personally feel divorce is DIVORCE any way you look at it, try to address it or get around. (I could feel this way b/c I'm in the will of God so I may be looking at it from my end only) 

God has shared with us in his word that he hates divorce. So since he hates it so should we. But then again... God hates alot of things we hate so why would divorce be any different (just being sarcastic) 

I think a good thing to do before getting married is to FULLY examine ourselves when it comes to the things of God and our committment to HIM. If we always find ourselves walking away from him or loving the things he hates then there's probably a chance we'll walk away from our marriage when its not going the way we want it to go.  And not only that....... if we have no understanding of marriage as a ministry then we should probably not get married in the first place. However if we do understand that marriage is a ministry we should understand how greatly the attacks are on ministries so why should your marriage be any different? 

These are all thoughts that came to mind after my initial question above. I just think if you cant be faithful to God..the creator of the universe, the lover of your soul, the one who created you in your mothers womb, who knew you before the foundations of the earth then how can you be faithful to a spouse who doesnt look the same to you any more, who's changed, who has short patience, who doesn't submit, who wont attend church with you (yet)? Dont get me wrong - none of these things are OK buuut because we know this we are to pray for our spouses. God never said it would be perfect in marriage. In fact you knew this when you stood at the altar - but you still went forth! So you should hang in there, stay prayerful, and wait for a testimony to share with another saint who's going to be going through what you're going through.

WE NEED TO SET THE EXAMPLE IN THE CHURCH!!!!! ENOUGH IS ENOUGH! So much divorce going on, one should be scared to even get married. Geesh!

I think at this point in my posting I'm a little upset  and I really didnt intend to go this much into it. Just me rambling and wondering why in the world is the rate of divorce so high amongst believers. It disgust me! Sorry!

Please know this is not meant to cause one who has been divorced or considering divorce any offences or to put them down. These are my thoughts and opinions only.

[ethereal]

Saved,

Your anger, disgust, etc. isn't misguided. Let me answer your original question: We always assume that b/c someone stood in a church in front of a preacher and said some vows, that God had anything to do w/the union. Now while God does honor marriage and hates divorce, He is not obligated to hold together a marriage that HE did not sanction (though out of the abundance of His love, He will). If a marriage falls apart and it was not put together by God, the truth is that your divorce is immenent (now, that also assumes that neither spouse receives Christ during the marriage, in which case, we go in a different direction...)

The word of God says in 1 Corinthians 7:15 "But if the unbeliever departs, let him depart; a brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases. But God has called us to peace." I quoted that passage of Scripture not to necessarily defend divorce, but more to encourage those that have done all that they could do, prayed, fasted and waited on God and still lost a mate. I was divorced almost 4 years ago and it was a terrible place for me, mostly b/c i was a believer at the time, but my wife was not. I had to repent for my part in it, but i also go back to an earlier statement: "If a marriage falls apart and it was not put together by God, the truth is that your divorce is immenent"

you are right that the body of Christ should be setting a far better example than we are.  alll i say  is that we need to continue warring for those who are married and those that will be married, "For we wrestle not against fleash and blood...."

[saved]

Yes ethereal, You've got it!

but more to encourage those that have done all that they could do, prayed, fasted and waited on God and still lost a mate.

I guess my concern comes more because of those who get married and then want to find the easy way out (divorce) when things get hard yet not having done what you stated above but wanting to throw in the towel just because/so easily. I think part of this could also be that some go into marriage thinking "well if it dont work, I'll just get a divorce." - I've had a person tell me this before. 

I know it can get hard but I also know it was never intended to be easy.

Maybe we dont have a true understanding of commitment and until we do we'll always find ourselves throwing in the towel w/o having done all we could.


Thanks for joining me in this discussion. 

[Breathedonme]

I, too, agree that the church should be setting the example.  I have heard too many stories as to why BELIEVERS feel they have a right to divorce, e.g., I am not happy, we don't make love like we used to, she's gotten fat, he doesn't give me the attention I need, etc.

While all of these things can cause problems, they are not justified by the Bible (this is not said to be condemning at all- this is coming from someone who is divorced).

I also would like to note, just my opinion for what it is worth, that you may search your soul, live as holy and sanctified before the Lord, name it and claim it, and the whole nine yards, but we as humans are ever changing.  Since God gives us a will to make choices, you might have the most wonderful human being as a spouse, but if that spouse begins to "go through" in his/her walk with Christ, trouble may come in.  If that spouse begins to let worldly things come front and center, there will be problems.

Some of us have been slam-dunked by spouses who began well, and then something changed.  There's a scripture in the Word that questions, what happened to you, you started off so well.  What came along to move you.

Look at some of the disciples who started out with Christ and after he spoke, they departed.

Asking God for discernment and waiting on Him is the key . . .  and whatever comes, if YOUR faith and relationship is strengthened, He will bring you through it.

My husband left for a younger woman after almost 11 years of marriage.  He was a new believer and i was backslider returning to the Lord.  I prayed, fasted, had people praying with me, tried to live a life to be the example plus became very, very ill with surgeries, etc.  I was DEVASTATED when he left our family.  Our daughter was also devastated.  There was a long expensive legal battle (due to his lies and stealing hundreds of thousands of dollars).

Now, eight years later, I am walking in my destiny -- doing the work of the Lord.  My family is healing.  Why?  Because ALL things work together for good . . .

Now, eight years later, he has left the other woman, never married her, produced two young children (and left her for another woman as well).  All the money he stole and spent, he is broker than broke.  He's back and forth with the court system for orders of protection against this woman, child support now to be paid not only to our daughter, but his other 2 children (I never gave him any grief - I left him in the Lord's hands).

NOW, eight years later, he contacts me and I am able to minister to him letting him know that Jesus loves Him and is ready to receive Him.  IS GOD AWESOME OR WHAT???

So, to those who have divorced and have gone through it, continue to lean on the Lord.  He's able to forgive, to mend the crooked places.

To those who are contemplating divorce, I encourage you to really lay before the Lord and His Word and WAIT on Him.  Don't allow pain and emotionalism to make you leave.  Also, be reminded that God is able and more than willing to help you through.

Yours in Christ,

[Forum Administrator]

Saved, I appreciate your passion against divorce. It could be that the reason you feel so strongly about it is because God wants to use you to strengthen marriages and to help others understand God's blueprint for marriage. There are some things that I have learned that may be helpful.

While it is true that in Malachi (chapter 2) God says He hates divorce (verse 16) but that's not the only thing He says He hates. In that same verse, God says He hats a man covering himself or his wife with violence. Which does He hate more? If you read through that chapter in its full context you will see that it is the acts of treachery that God is more focused on and not divorce. Why? Because it is the acts of treachery that lead to divorce. (Assignment: look up treacherous in the dictionary. You may be surprised at the all-encompassing defintion of that word.) Okay, I'll make it easier for you: here's what I found when I looked up that word:

• Willful betrayal of fidelity, confidence, or trust


• Deliberate breach of faith; calculated violation of trust


• Not to be relied upon; not dependable or trustworthy


• Marked by unforeseen hazards; dangerous or deceptive


• Not true to duty or obligation; disloyal


• Having no religious faith


• Unworthy of faith or trust; unreliable

I guarantee you that the cause for any divorce will fall under one or more of the above definitions. Divorce is and ugly word, but treachery is even uglier.

God hates divorce and He hates when we deal treacherously with our mates. Which does He hate more? The Bible doesn't say. But if I had to make an "educated" guess, I would say the acts of treachery. Why? Because God permits divorce and even remarriage (see Deuteronomy 24:1-2 and 1 Corinthians 7:15 and verses 27-28), but He never permits an act of treachery but He permits divorce (again, see the above references). Why does He permit divorce? He permits it because He is just and He realizes that the heart of man is wicked (Jesus called it 'hardness of heart'). There are people who will carry out all of the above definitions of treachery in their marriages and either expect the innocent spouse to just live with it and/or turn around and divorce the person who is innocent of the wrongdoings in the marriage. Fortunately for a lot of us, God has made provision so that the innocent are not punished for the wrongdoings of the wicked. God always deals with divorce at the heart level. That is why we need wisdom and discernment when we are dealing with those facing or contemplating divorce.

This is also why it is important to have people in the church who are able to rightly divide God's word and to hear and judge civil matters involving believers (including marital issues). While every issue is not spelled out in scripture, there are scriptural principles that God has given us in addition to His wisdom and the discernment of His Spirit that He makes available to us that will allow us to address the issues leading to divorce.

The problem is NOT that there is too much divorce in the church. That is where we miss it and why there continues to be so much divorce in the church. The problem is that there is too much treachery. Divorce is the fruit; treachery is the root. Attack and destroy the root and you will rid yourself of the fruit.

We spend so much time debating about whether or not divorce is biblical instead of 1) making a conscious and focused effort to teach and reinforce God's blueprint for marriage (i.e. the roles, responsibilities and purpose of marriage) to those who desire to be married and to those who already are married; and 2) teaching against the acts of treachery that lead to divorce (e.g. unfaithfulness, deceit, perversion, abuse, abandonment, etc.). If we as a Body begin to teach and encourage those who desire to be married and those who are married what the Bible says about marriage and what it has to say about the various acts of treachery, we would see a dramatic change in the quality (and perhaps quantity) of marriages and we would see a marked decrease in the divorce rate involving believers.

Sometimes we're just plain wicked; sometimes we're just plain ignorant and only God knows the difference. Only God knows the hearts of those who truly desired to please Him. That is why there are people who have been divorced (such as Breathedonme, ethereal, and me) who God turns around and uses to help others. As a matter of fact, had I not experienced the pain of being married to a wicked person--even as a Christian with the best intentions married to another "Christian"--there would have been no book and there would be no Deep Waters. Just as Breathedonme testified, God will cause it all to work for good--even a divorce. Do you know why? Because He knows those who love Him and who are called according to His purpose. One thing a bad marriage or divorce can't stop or even hinder for a person who loves God and that is purpose. The only thing that stops/hinders purpose is being unwilling to love/obey God.

There is a whole lot I could say about the ministry and purpose of marriage (and I've said quite a bit of it in response to many posts in this forum). I would encourage all of us to stop getting hung up on the divorce issue and to start getting involved with making a difference in the quality of our pre- and post-marital relationships. We can talk about divorce all day long and it won't make a difference. If your disgust does not motivate you to make a difference, no one is helped. But if we set our minds and hearts towards promoting the good success of God's blueprint for Christian marriage and relationships, we will make a difference. And for those who do want to make a difference, I encourage you to get clear not only on what God says about divorce, but what He says about marriage. Ask God to show you how you can help to fortify relationships against treachery.

For those who may be wondering what my understanding and position on divorce is, check out pages 58-61 of my book Though The Vision Tarry: Waiting For My Promised Mate. If anyone is interested, I would be happy to post an excerpt from those pages. (I'm too sleepy to do it now  ). If you want to know how I came to this understanding, you'll have to read the whole book. 

[saved]

I agree Forum Administrator! Your words are powerful!

I understand everything you have shared in your posting and it may be me but I sense some frustration in reading your posting when you refer to folks getting hung up on divorce.

You have given me a different outlook on it. I hate to blame everything on the enemy but this too could be one of his many tricks - having us focus on divorce - the ending, when we should be focusing on the beginning - treachery which leads to divorce as you pointed out. I guess since we spend so much time focusing on divorce we fail to realize there are other things going on that can be fixed before the fruit (divorce) springs forth.

My post wasn't intended to offend any one who has been divorce!!! My apologies if it did.

[Forum Administrator]

Hi saved. I don't think anyone took offense to your post: I certainly didn't. (Maybe I should have added some extra smileys.  ) I've lived through the whole dogmatic scenario of the "God is against divorce" doctrine, and I actually helped to promote that doctrine for a long time. However, God turned me around and set me straight on the issue and I realized I was swallowing and regurgitating the doctrines of men without searching the scriptures and seeing what God had to say on the matter. Once I did search the scriptures (a very lengthy process), my perspective was and remains crystal clear.

I feel a responsibility now to share what I've learned when given opportunity. Being trained as a counselor, I was taught to get to the root of issues if there is any hope of effecting change. So whether it is divorce or any other "fruit" issue, my goal is always to get to the root and to encourage others to do the same. 

[saved]

Hi Forum Administrator,

More smileys would have helped (only joking)!       

But yes I understand and you are very right. Your words are powerful in a good way! I was wondering if you were a counselor and now that I know you are my heart feels glad that someone will benefit from what God has given you in regards to marriage like we do here at Deep Waters!

THANKS!

[Veviticus]

Amen to the moderator!!!  I have just read your book and it has truly been a Godsend!  It was if I was reading about myself word for word.  I have been seperated for over 3 years and I know that there is no chance whatsoever for my husband and I to ever get back together.  Just like you, the Lord has shown me that he has not changed but gotten worse, and I totally fell out of love with him years before the seperation happened.  For some time I have been able to see him as a brother in Christ who I hope will one day the lightbulb will come on for, and not the husband who cheated, lied, stole, slept with other women, and put drugs before his family and God.  I am now in the process of seeing what my options are on how to proceed with my divorce since money is truly an issue.  Please keep me up in prayer concerning this issue.